drew sagan

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Posts by drew sagan

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  22

  Latest Witness Rumor

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  apparently, there are new rumors about a brother talking with people at the un about religion.

  supposedly, they told him that they want to "turn on religion" by taxing churches.

  this is all ok with witnesses because the society is wisely taking ownership of kingdom halls and so they can afford to pay the taxation.. when i heard this explanation, i didn't know whether to puke or laugh out loud.

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  drew sagan

  this is old news man...
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  39

  We predicted World War I - How would you answer?

  by VM44 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  some old timer jws (and probably some newer ones as well) say that they (the watchotwer) predicted world war i which broke out in 1914.. they apparently truly believe that statement.. how would you answer?.

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  drew sagan

  I think the only correct response is to do what others here have mentioned, call their bluff. They have been told by the WTS that they essentially predicted the war, but no real evidence is ever provided. Various quotes are given, but they are usually cut off and the context is missing. Ask them to provide the evidence for their claim.
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  250

  Jesus not crucified on torture stake. Impossible!

  by sacolton in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  unwittingly the germans, during wwii, they experimented with many, many ways for killing people, efficiently and quickly.

  their records show that when a person is suspended with their hands over their head, as they would be on the jw "torture stake," they can survive for approximately one hour.

  if their feet are tied down, as well, the time is reduced to about 15 minutes.. .

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  drew sagan

  The motive behind the change to a teaching that Jesus died on an upright pole is strictly for publicity and marketing. Rutherford did it to be different from traditional churches. It provided him an opportunity to throw stones at organized religion. It provided a point of difference, so he could make his claim. To say that only satanically controlled religions would have the cross is just a straw man argument.

  Exactly. It helped Rutherford advance a world view which rests on the idea that all religious systems (outside of his own) where full of "corrupt" teachings. Of course, when he created doctrines because of mistakes, problems, and downright quackery those are simply "bible based", no questions asked. You see things how you want to see them.

  Reniaa....how about direct answers to the other direct questions asked you on this thread?

  That suggests she is actually here to do more than just annoy people.
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  30

  Why do we say Witness teachings are idiotic - Weren't all of us Witnesses?

  by BonaFide in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so many on this forum talk about how witnesses are stupid, ignorant, unable to reason, and brainwashed.

  we also pick apart the watchtower as having such stupid teachings, and how anyone can see all of it is so ridiculous.

  some use terms like the filthful slave, and the washtowel.. yet, many of us were witnesses for years, or even decades.

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  drew sagan

  I'm sure I have referenced JW teachings in that way from time to time in the past, but not recently. I tend to simply refer to JW teachings as unrealistic, illogical, or outdated.

  In my own personal case I came to believe JW teachings when I was very young and impressionable. Many on this board where brough up in the religion and were taught it by their parents and grandparents. Very few accepted the religion when they were full grown adults.

  The main point being that most accepted JW teachings when they were impressionable and young.
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  38

  We're not a cult because we don't have communes

  by carla in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  have you ever heard a dub say that they are not a cult because they don't live in a commune?

  (aside from all the other reasons they are a cult- see other thread about wt mind control) my question is, isn't bethel rather like a commune?

  and what about the wt farms?.

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  drew sagan

  Sure they do. Over 50 pages inside the proclaimers book showing various facilities throughout the world where people work and live inside.
  
  Defining cults can be tricky. Regardless of how the members live the WTS is an organization that exercises an extreme amount of control over its followers. This is the reason for the cult label being attached to the JWs and this is what should be addressed, not definitions.
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  8

  Surrounded 24/7

  by Skip it in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was not associated with this "organization" until the age of about 19 when i was dating my current wife.

  she was df'ed for the 1st couple of a years that we were together and thats when my intense resentment started.

  i gave in to her bs after hearing the overwhelming fear from her about the generation that was about to end and how she had to get reinstated because she is just the happiest person when she's a witness.

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  drew sagan

  Over and over again Witnesses are told that the best thing they possibly can do is model their behavior around the activities prescribed to the by the Watchtower Society.
  
  At its core the Watchtower functions as a behavioral device. What do Witnesses really want from a person when the go door to door? Is it to instruct people to believe everything they do? Possibly. But it never ends at belief, does it? They just don't show up at your house, teach you a new set of beliefs, and then go on their way. Rather they follow the structure that you just defined. Meeting by meeting, activity by activity they seek to get you involved in 100% of all activity that is dictated by the Watchtower. A person does not have to believe anything the Watchtower teaches but if they go about the activities prescribed by the Watchtower individual JWs will think the person is one of them, and thus accept them.
  
  I'm of the opinion that as long as you understand how the Watchtower system functions it can be rather benign. The way the watchtower really can be harmful when individuals are ignorant as to how it is heavily influencing their lives. If you don't believe watchtower leaders are chosen by god then they really hold no special power over you, which is what can really be problematic. Your wife however, is under such influence.
  
  Witnesses will always see you as another "potential member". Might as well get used to that. Whether or not you come to some sort of compromise with your wife is up to you. I understand that the JWs enthusiasm to convert people to their lifestyle can make compromise rather difficult.
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  15

  Your are invited to this evenings virtual memorial

  by drew sagan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  to participate in this evenings virtual memorial please take a moment and stare at these items, then post your feelings:.

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  drew sagan

  To participate in this evenings virtual memorial please take a moment and stare at these items, then post your feelings:

  
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  41

  Does the rapid end of paper news forbode a crisis for the WT?

  by jamiebowers in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  according to this article, not all papers will be gone, and some that are gone was due to mismanagement more than the bad economy: http://www.slate.com/id/2215154/?gt1=38001.

  that being said, i'm sure the wb&ts will do whatever is most profitable for them, as usual..

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  drew sagan

  IMO I think we may see the wachtower eventually increasing the amount of material it publishes. It's not a likely scenario but quite possibly the Watchtower may bite the bullet and begin to start charging for their books (and pay the necessary taxes on top of that). Because JWs are so print oriented they could possibly sell all kinds of things to the members. Cheap books, reprints, notebooks, calanders, bookbags, who knows what else. The could possibly be making lots of money of off retail sales to a customer base that will suck up anything it creates.
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  11

  No More MS Doodies!!!!

  by tresdecu in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  posted this at the end of the last thread i started (entirely diff subject) but: i resigned from the world of the ministerial servant drone on sunday.

  no more ridiculous 5min announcement parts.

  no more idiotic q and a'a.

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  drew sagan

  enjoy the sheparding calls that will be coming your way

  "now brother, why don't you appreciate the privlidge that Jehovah gave you?"
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  15

  Memorial Thursday: why am I still getting an invitation?

  by And He Ran in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i stopped going to meetings five years ago.

  all my family are jws.

  why does my mother still give me a memorial invitation even though i don't go?

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  drew sagan

  Sure it's a last chance hope. As long as they continue to believe the JWs are the "truth" they will hope you come back to it. Duh The Watchtower magazine has also done a great job of convicing JWs that there is no possible way a person can leave for good reasons. This creates the idea in the JW community that nobody is justified in leaving. Everybody who leaves has simply made a terrible mistake and it's the JWs hope that one day they will see their own error